I don't think this Verdi Requiem concert is going to happen this year. It was partly my own fault. I kept waiting to see what was going to happen with the Gioconda production. I am definitely doing it next year, though, now that I know that the pastor will let me use the sanctuary without paying (I will just turn over the ticket money to the church to use for whatever charity they are sponsoring for Lent that year.) So I will set a date this November for next March.
My teacher says that he really would like to try to do it and the soprano who sang in my Verdi concert definitely wants to do it, she just had a few unforeseen issues to deal with this year.
As for the long deferred post, I am talking about what I referred to here.
Both my therapist and the nice man, Zachary, who reads this blog, said that I should "advertise" for older singers.
I want to post something on the Forum but I find that place daunting. Interestingly, I looked there a few days ago and there was a thread about dramatic voices so I posted something there.
I think I find the Forum daunting because when I first began reading it, probably 5 years ago (how time flies), I thought of myself as a "real" singer who had something to offer - I'm not speaking vocally, but simply as someone who had sung, who could claim singing experiences as a part of my past. So I would post a whole range of things from questions to health advice. I actually got quite a bit of help there both with my Samson et Dalila concert and with finding repertoire to sing as church solos. But then something would always scare me away.
I think I'm afraid if I start a thread looking for avocational singers in their 50s and older with big operatic voices, who are not professionals, but who would love to sing and help me produce concerts, etc., that someone will laugh at me (or worse, no one will respond).
I guess I just have to do it. I was going to wait until I saw my therapist (this wouldn't be until the 17th) because she said I could write out what I was going to say and read it to her and then just put it out into the universe.
What I had in mind was something like
"I am a 61-year old dramatic mezzo living in mid-Manhattan who began studying voice seriously at the age of 54. I am looking for other singers with similar demographics who are eager to perform standard operatic repertoire, with or without 100% technical proficiency, and would be willing and happy to help me out with the cost and planning of operatic concerts and concert operas. Of course older more experienced singers would be welcome too, but I want people who would really be interested in this and not jump ship if a better offer comes along. I am also just interested in meeting people with a similar demographic profile, even people who don't live here, so that we can correspond and share experiences.
So I will sit on this until Monday and see if I can bring myself to post it.
Now, as I have to get up at 6 to sing in a 9 am service (I defy any paid choir singer to tell me they take what they do more seriously than I do) I had better hop in a bath and hit the pillow.
Showing posts with label peer group. Show all posts
Showing posts with label peer group. Show all posts
Saturday, February 4, 2012
Tuesday, January 31, 2012
I Dream of Feedback
First, an update. I got all the files back from the engineer. The ones without reverb sound much better however there is an echo-ish sound to the ones recorded the second day, because the engineer did something different, which he thought would make things sound better, but didn't. I would say that other than the Nabucco aria, all the files reflect my singing at its more or less best right now. I will decide when the engineer gets back whether I want to "produce" a CD to sell at the church, or only to distribute to friends (I will not include the Nabucoo aria). If I do the latter I will not spend money on packaging.
I think I may have to wait another year to do this Verdi Requiem. I now only have two months and my teacher and the soprano who sang at my concert now are not available as a result of musical and nonmusical commitments.
The good news is that the pastor said I can use the church for free, which I assume is an open invitation, not time limited.
I tried two people, one a tenor the other a soprano and the tenor said no thank you and the soprano I think is looking for something at a higher level. If I can't get three people and a pianist by Friday I think I will officially postpone it until next year and start planning in the Fall.
Also, I got a nice letter from the person I auditioned for earlier in the month saying he would keep my resume on file. They seem like nice people to work with and I am more comfortable with people my own age.
Finally to the subject of this post.
I realized that there is a type of feedback that I want that I am not getting, and really it has to do with the same issue I brought up in this post.
I realize I don't really need all that much feedback about my singing. I get that from my teacher, sometimes from accompanists, and, in a different context, from the choir director.
The feedback I desperately want and have not gotten is where would be a good place either for me to sing (it can be bloody anywhere as long as I can sing classical music and don't have to pay more than $25 a pop) or to meet people. My therapist was the one who suggested meetups, but when I went everyone was at a much higher level (not to mention much younger) so I was not comfortable.
One helpful suggestion I got a long time ago (I only just now remembered it) was several years ago, when I had just left the Unitarian church and The Mentor, a woman I met online said that I should join a small community chorus that sang classical music. If I did that, then A I would be one of the better singers and would probably get solo opportunities and B I could just sit and quietly work on my vocal technical issues in the course of whatever music we were working on.
So that is more or less what I have done with this church choir. The music is suited to classical voices, the choir is small enough that, yes, it matters if I'm there or not, I would definitely say I am one of the better singers with more training, which is a morale booster, I get solo opportunities, and I can work on technique as things arise (not to mention that I have been forced to develop a better pianissimo high A flat than most dramatic mezzos, even a lot of professionals). And there are a lot of social and spiritual fringe benefits.
I find it hard to believe that in a city as big as this one there aren't some older adults with big operatic voices that they began training late, who will never be professionals or even, apparently, good enough to get cast in most of the amateur productions in the city (these people used to get cast in leading roles in the small companies in the 70s) but who can slog their way through some operatic arias and scenes and even do some nice singing, and would like the opportunity to do so.
Or I just want someone to invite me to do something which is why I don't like frequenting places where I'm in the 15th or the 20th percentile in terms of skill. It's not ego, really.
ETA: I think a lot of this problem would be solved if I could even find one!!! person with similar demographics (older, still working on technique, hungry not burned out) who would be my support buddy. I really feel all alone with this most of the time, which is a major part of my problem, particularly in terms of how I feel. If I had a buddy who could go with me to these meetups, for example, we could be each other's cheering section. The other people there are all talking to each other about auditions and agents etc. so if I had someone to go with we could talk about whether a particular note or phrase sounded better than it did last time, or whatever, and I know I would be less nervous that I was when I went there and basically might as well have been by myself in a vacuum.
I think I may have to wait another year to do this Verdi Requiem. I now only have two months and my teacher and the soprano who sang at my concert now are not available as a result of musical and nonmusical commitments.
The good news is that the pastor said I can use the church for free, which I assume is an open invitation, not time limited.
I tried two people, one a tenor the other a soprano and the tenor said no thank you and the soprano I think is looking for something at a higher level. If I can't get three people and a pianist by Friday I think I will officially postpone it until next year and start planning in the Fall.
Also, I got a nice letter from the person I auditioned for earlier in the month saying he would keep my resume on file. They seem like nice people to work with and I am more comfortable with people my own age.
Finally to the subject of this post.
I realized that there is a type of feedback that I want that I am not getting, and really it has to do with the same issue I brought up in this post.
I realize I don't really need all that much feedback about my singing. I get that from my teacher, sometimes from accompanists, and, in a different context, from the choir director.
The feedback I desperately want and have not gotten is where would be a good place either for me to sing (it can be bloody anywhere as long as I can sing classical music and don't have to pay more than $25 a pop) or to meet people. My therapist was the one who suggested meetups, but when I went everyone was at a much higher level (not to mention much younger) so I was not comfortable.
One helpful suggestion I got a long time ago (I only just now remembered it) was several years ago, when I had just left the Unitarian church and The Mentor, a woman I met online said that I should join a small community chorus that sang classical music. If I did that, then A I would be one of the better singers and would probably get solo opportunities and B I could just sit and quietly work on my vocal technical issues in the course of whatever music we were working on.
So that is more or less what I have done with this church choir. The music is suited to classical voices, the choir is small enough that, yes, it matters if I'm there or not, I would definitely say I am one of the better singers with more training, which is a morale booster, I get solo opportunities, and I can work on technique as things arise (not to mention that I have been forced to develop a better pianissimo high A flat than most dramatic mezzos, even a lot of professionals). And there are a lot of social and spiritual fringe benefits.
I find it hard to believe that in a city as big as this one there aren't some older adults with big operatic voices that they began training late, who will never be professionals or even, apparently, good enough to get cast in most of the amateur productions in the city (these people used to get cast in leading roles in the small companies in the 70s) but who can slog their way through some operatic arias and scenes and even do some nice singing, and would like the opportunity to do so.
Or I just want someone to invite me to do something which is why I don't like frequenting places where I'm in the 15th or the 20th percentile in terms of skill. It's not ego, really.
ETA: I think a lot of this problem would be solved if I could even find one!!! person with similar demographics (older, still working on technique, hungry not burned out) who would be my support buddy. I really feel all alone with this most of the time, which is a major part of my problem, particularly in terms of how I feel. If I had a buddy who could go with me to these meetups, for example, we could be each other's cheering section. The other people there are all talking to each other about auditions and agents etc. so if I had someone to go with we could talk about whether a particular note or phrase sounded better than it did last time, or whatever, and I know I would be less nervous that I was when I went there and basically might as well have been by myself in a vacuum.
Tuesday, November 1, 2011
A Wise Man Speaks
Today I had a voice lesson after not having had one for about three weeks. My lesson is always an hour of singing and a half hour of talking about what's going on with me in my life as a singer.
My teacher pried out of me all the negative emotions I had been feeling about the issue of these meetups, etc. and he told me a number of things that were either confidence-boosting or illuminating in some way.
First, we had our last (I think) rehash of the concert. He said overall I did very well, despite a few shrill notes. That both of the people I sang with would be happy to sing with me again, and that they would not have felt that if I hadn't done a decent job. He said I sang much better than I had at the two big performances he had heard: Samson et Dalila and the concert the year before at the other Lutheran church.
Then he said a few things about the issue of the meetups and my not connecting with anyone.
First, he said that "in the world" (he said his wife had mentioned this) older women are "invisible". Yes, I have been aware of that for a long time which is something I have tried to explain to some younger female friends, most notably (OK readers, don't get into a feminist frenzy) that "sexual harrassment" is mainly a younger woman's issue. If you're over 40, even if you've got a body to die for, nobody gives a flying fig.
Then he also said that in the world of performing, older men are also invisible.
He said that many people at these things may think that the vocal flaws that I still have are a result of age-related decline. Now both he and I know that the opposite is true - they are there because I haven't fine-tuned my instrument enough yet. But that if people think I'm going "downhill" because I'm older this will scare them.
He also said (I thought this was a bit harsh) that if people are going to these sorts of things they are not happy with where they are, or they would be rehearsing for real gigs, not singing at meetups. (That was what I had thought originally, which is why I was very surprised at the level of most of the people there. It also bears out what I had written about earlier that there are hordes of singers as good as most of the pros with noplace to sing.)
In any event, he said I should focus on whatever I'm planning next,not singing at these groups if doing that wasn't helping me develop more confidence.
I think what I want to do (and I am still going to post a notice of some sort), rather than starting my own meetup or looking for a large group of people more demographically like me, simply to try to find even one older singer who was a late starter, who will go to one of the existing meetups with me. So then as I said to someone we can be each other's cheering section and if we don't "matter" to anyone else who's there, we will matter to each other and will be less nervous.
And I shouldn't forget to add on the singing front, that at my lesson I ran through two arias I hadn't sung in over a year: Dalila's "Amour Viens Aider" and "O Mio Fernando" from La Favorita and my teacher said I sounded like a completely different person from last year.
My teacher pried out of me all the negative emotions I had been feeling about the issue of these meetups, etc. and he told me a number of things that were either confidence-boosting or illuminating in some way.
First, we had our last (I think) rehash of the concert. He said overall I did very well, despite a few shrill notes. That both of the people I sang with would be happy to sing with me again, and that they would not have felt that if I hadn't done a decent job. He said I sang much better than I had at the two big performances he had heard: Samson et Dalila and the concert the year before at the other Lutheran church.
Then he said a few things about the issue of the meetups and my not connecting with anyone.
First, he said that "in the world" (he said his wife had mentioned this) older women are "invisible". Yes, I have been aware of that for a long time which is something I have tried to explain to some younger female friends, most notably (OK readers, don't get into a feminist frenzy) that "sexual harrassment" is mainly a younger woman's issue. If you're over 40, even if you've got a body to die for, nobody gives a flying fig.
Then he also said that in the world of performing, older men are also invisible.
He said that many people at these things may think that the vocal flaws that I still have are a result of age-related decline. Now both he and I know that the opposite is true - they are there because I haven't fine-tuned my instrument enough yet. But that if people think I'm going "downhill" because I'm older this will scare them.
He also said (I thought this was a bit harsh) that if people are going to these sorts of things they are not happy with where they are, or they would be rehearsing for real gigs, not singing at meetups. (That was what I had thought originally, which is why I was very surprised at the level of most of the people there. It also bears out what I had written about earlier that there are hordes of singers as good as most of the pros with noplace to sing.)
In any event, he said I should focus on whatever I'm planning next,not singing at these groups if doing that wasn't helping me develop more confidence.
I think what I want to do (and I am still going to post a notice of some sort), rather than starting my own meetup or looking for a large group of people more demographically like me, simply to try to find even one older singer who was a late starter, who will go to one of the existing meetups with me. So then as I said to someone we can be each other's cheering section and if we don't "matter" to anyone else who's there, we will matter to each other and will be less nervous.
And I shouldn't forget to add on the singing front, that at my lesson I ran through two arias I hadn't sung in over a year: Dalila's "Amour Viens Aider" and "O Mio Fernando" from La Favorita and my teacher said I sounded like a completely different person from last year.
Sunday, October 30, 2011
Want Ad Becomes an "Assignment"
As my therapist was the one who suggested that I go to those singing Meetups, and as that did not work out, we decided I needed to regroup.
Surely in a city as big as New York, there must be other people like me. The question is how to find them. So what are my demographics, really?
1. I am what I laughingly refer to as a "tweenior", meaning I am not old enough for Social Security or Medicare or any other senior discounts but I am past middle age.
2. I started the serious study of singing late (whether or not I was studying seriously or even being serious about it when I studied before, between the ages of 26 and 30, is questionable, in retrospect).
3. I have a big operatic voice. (Whether or not singing is "only" a hobby, I am not a choral-type singer with a small pleasant voice.)
4. I still have some technical "issues" to work out and believe that my best singing is still ahead of me.
5. As I am a "newbie" to all this I am hungry hungry hungry hungry to do it. I am by no means "scaling back".
6. However, as I am the age I am, I have a whole life infrastructure that can't be thrown into disarray because I'm singing.
7. I do my best if I am one of the "better" (not the best, if I'm the best I'm in the wrong place) singers in a given group, so I am not going to thrive in a group full of YAPPers and older managed singers.
8. I want to be somewhere where my singing, and my story, would be of interest to other people who have had similar experiences. I don't thrive if I feel I'm being politely ignored, either.
9. Also, if I meet peers compared to whom I am performing at a high level, they might be interested in inviting me to perform somewhere with them, and I wouldn't have to do all the inviting and all the planning.
I was thinking about posting something on the Forum but even thinking about that place makes me want to crawl under the couch.
My therapist said Craigslist but that makes me nervous. Would leave myself open to too many crazies.
Maybe I'll post something in my pseudonymous blog. I have some regular readers, some of whom do know me by my real name also. They might have some advice.
I would have posted something there first, but no one is around on Sunday and the post would get lost.
Now I'm off to sing the alto part in a Bach cantata for Reformation Sunday, which is a big Lutheran holiday.
Surely in a city as big as New York, there must be other people like me. The question is how to find them. So what are my demographics, really?
1. I am what I laughingly refer to as a "tweenior", meaning I am not old enough for Social Security or Medicare or any other senior discounts but I am past middle age.
2. I started the serious study of singing late (whether or not I was studying seriously or even being serious about it when I studied before, between the ages of 26 and 30, is questionable, in retrospect).
3. I have a big operatic voice. (Whether or not singing is "only" a hobby, I am not a choral-type singer with a small pleasant voice.)
4. I still have some technical "issues" to work out and believe that my best singing is still ahead of me.
5. As I am a "newbie" to all this I am hungry hungry hungry hungry to do it. I am by no means "scaling back".
6. However, as I am the age I am, I have a whole life infrastructure that can't be thrown into disarray because I'm singing.
7. I do my best if I am one of the "better" (not the best, if I'm the best I'm in the wrong place) singers in a given group, so I am not going to thrive in a group full of YAPPers and older managed singers.
8. I want to be somewhere where my singing, and my story, would be of interest to other people who have had similar experiences. I don't thrive if I feel I'm being politely ignored, either.
9. Also, if I meet peers compared to whom I am performing at a high level, they might be interested in inviting me to perform somewhere with them, and I wouldn't have to do all the inviting and all the planning.
I was thinking about posting something on the Forum but even thinking about that place makes me want to crawl under the couch.
My therapist said Craigslist but that makes me nervous. Would leave myself open to too many crazies.
Maybe I'll post something in my pseudonymous blog. I have some regular readers, some of whom do know me by my real name also. They might have some advice.
I would have posted something there first, but no one is around on Sunday and the post would get lost.
Now I'm off to sing the alto part in a Bach cantata for Reformation Sunday, which is a big Lutheran holiday.
Saturday, October 22, 2011
Baby D Posts a Want Ad
Friday I was talking to my therapist about how unhappy I am that I can't seem to find a meaningful way to participate in any of these Meetups, Sing-Things, Soirees, etc.
This is for at least three reasons: I have limited time,I have limited confidence, and I have no peer group or support system, even a support system of one (meaning a family member or peer who would come with me to some of these things).
When I started going to these kinds of things, I really thought I would meet some kind of peer group there and be able to network. Did I have an overly aggrandized view of myself? Why didn't anything click? Yes, I was nervous, but to some extent so is everyone. But most of the people I saw at those things had a history, and with that history came relationships, and out of relationships came opportunities to do things together, commiserate, support each other, make plans. The problem is aside from being one of a pool of choir soloists, I don't have anything like that, so I would go to those things and feel very alone. I would feel nervous, not to mention depressed because often I would have had a fight with my partner beforehand about why I was going at all, then I would feel that I didn't sing my best, and then I would get no feedback - I don't even mean feedback about my singing, I mean feedback about my place in the whole universe of singing.
To paraphrase Soujourner Truth, all the beginners were young and all the mature people were polished (and the mature people were barely in their late 40s).
So whom did I think I would meet at one of these things? A late-starting classical singer who wanted more than just being a soloist in a amateur chorus or choir but didn't have the time to rehearse an opera four nights a week? Someone who could sing his/her way through an aria or scene well enough to please an audience but not well enough to impress the cognoscenti??
So where are these people???? Do they even exist??
One thing I miss about that horrid Unitarian church was at least when I was there they did all sorts of things besides church services - cabarets, etc., so I could get up and sing an aria and be a diva for an evening, wear something fabulous, get a lot of applause, and not overtax myself. And usually I would know about this at least two months in advance so I could prepare myself.
The church where I sing now doesn't do these sorts of things.
Up until recently, I was measuring myself against how well I could sing the material I was singing. I had no idea, really, how extremely low down the food chain I was because I didn't really fathom the mass of talented people who were doing this.
So what do I want (I mean besides wanting to be able to sing well and put on some kind of something once or twice a year.)? (My last post was about how I defined success. OK. I know that. What I'm asking myself is what kind of environment do I want that I so desperately feel I don't have?)
So here goes:
SUPERANNUATED DIVA WITH MODEST TALENT is seeking classical singers over 50 who are not "professionals", "emerging professionals", or "managed". Preferably those who started singing late, sing well enough to slog through some operatic rep without making the audience cringe but don't have the time or money to get it together to sing this sort of material in public more the two or three times a year. A love of dressing to the nines and chewing up the scenery a plus.
I cynically thought of posting something like this on the forum but even thinking about that place makes me want to crawl under the couch.
There's also something Wizard of Oz-ish about all this, too. The Wizard told the Scarecrow he didn't need a brain, he needed a degree. There's a part of me that thinks what I need isn't a voice (I've got that) or a techniqiue (I've got a lot of that and who has it all anyhow?) or ever "the noive" as the Cowardly Lion says, but someone to validate me. A buddy who says "Hey, are you going to the Meetup on ____________?" "Let's go," gives me a shove and a smile, some honest feedback, and a promise that soon we would be back again.
This is for at least three reasons: I have limited time,I have limited confidence, and I have no peer group or support system, even a support system of one (meaning a family member or peer who would come with me to some of these things).
When I started going to these kinds of things, I really thought I would meet some kind of peer group there and be able to network. Did I have an overly aggrandized view of myself? Why didn't anything click? Yes, I was nervous, but to some extent so is everyone. But most of the people I saw at those things had a history, and with that history came relationships, and out of relationships came opportunities to do things together, commiserate, support each other, make plans. The problem is aside from being one of a pool of choir soloists, I don't have anything like that, so I would go to those things and feel very alone. I would feel nervous, not to mention depressed because often I would have had a fight with my partner beforehand about why I was going at all, then I would feel that I didn't sing my best, and then I would get no feedback - I don't even mean feedback about my singing, I mean feedback about my place in the whole universe of singing.
To paraphrase Soujourner Truth, all the beginners were young and all the mature people were polished (and the mature people were barely in their late 40s).
So whom did I think I would meet at one of these things? A late-starting classical singer who wanted more than just being a soloist in a amateur chorus or choir but didn't have the time to rehearse an opera four nights a week? Someone who could sing his/her way through an aria or scene well enough to please an audience but not well enough to impress the cognoscenti??
So where are these people???? Do they even exist??
One thing I miss about that horrid Unitarian church was at least when I was there they did all sorts of things besides church services - cabarets, etc., so I could get up and sing an aria and be a diva for an evening, wear something fabulous, get a lot of applause, and not overtax myself. And usually I would know about this at least two months in advance so I could prepare myself.
The church where I sing now doesn't do these sorts of things.
Up until recently, I was measuring myself against how well I could sing the material I was singing. I had no idea, really, how extremely low down the food chain I was because I didn't really fathom the mass of talented people who were doing this.
So what do I want (I mean besides wanting to be able to sing well and put on some kind of something once or twice a year.)? (My last post was about how I defined success. OK. I know that. What I'm asking myself is what kind of environment do I want that I so desperately feel I don't have?)
So here goes:
SUPERANNUATED DIVA WITH MODEST TALENT is seeking classical singers over 50 who are not "professionals", "emerging professionals", or "managed". Preferably those who started singing late, sing well enough to slog through some operatic rep without making the audience cringe but don't have the time or money to get it together to sing this sort of material in public more the two or three times a year. A love of dressing to the nines and chewing up the scenery a plus.
I cynically thought of posting something like this on the forum but even thinking about that place makes me want to crawl under the couch.
There's also something Wizard of Oz-ish about all this, too. The Wizard told the Scarecrow he didn't need a brain, he needed a degree. There's a part of me that thinks what I need isn't a voice (I've got that) or a techniqiue (I've got a lot of that and who has it all anyhow?) or ever "the noive" as the Cowardly Lion says, but someone to validate me. A buddy who says "Hey, are you going to the Meetup on ____________?" "Let's go," gives me a shove and a smile, some honest feedback, and a promise that soon we would be back again.
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